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Author Topic: Cleganes  (Read 2440 times)
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Derrick Heyoka
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« on: February 02, 2007, 02:25:11 PM »

Soooooo.  Poor, poor Sandor.  Hounded by life's problems.  I had such hopes for him turning shiznit around (at least a little) all Jaime style.  He was kinda OK for a while there but you get the impression that was just how it turned out, not like he'd changed.  Anyway, he died off camera... anyone think he's still alive?  I don't, although killing a big char like the Hound off that way sure is mean!  Smiley

Gregor.  Had a mountain of problems he did.  This fucknut died off camera too.  Anyone else notice Qyburn started talkin' about some big unstoppable knight about the time they shipped his head off to Dorne, asking Circei if he could use this knight?  Remember Circei saying that the smiths said no human man could possibly bear the weight of the armor he had her order for him?  ZOMG HEADLESS (?) ZOMBIE MOUNTAIN!  Or, probably just maybe someone else's head?  OR maybe you think Gregor's fine, still alive?  Anyone?  I'm guessing I'm not the only one who thinks a big skary zombie Gregor is around the corner eh?
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Lucy St. Jude
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« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2007, 01:10:56 PM »

The Hound's not dead, he's living on the island of the monks as an acolyte.
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Derrick Heyoka
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« Reply #2 on: February 07, 2007, 09:58:04 PM »

The Hound's not dead, he's living on the island of the monks as an acolyte.

Is that a theory or a Shmoo missed something statement?
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Nalroth
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« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2007, 09:39:41 AM »

The Hound's not dead, he's living on the island of the monks as an acolyte.

I was curious about that too. If it is a theory I am going to have to re-read the whole series to see where it comes from.
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Derrick Heyoka
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« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2007, 12:26:17 PM »

Wellll the last place anyone claims to have seen him (and not an impostor) was the monk leader guy talking to Brienne on the Quiet Isle.  He said he found Sandor, who asked for mercy (which lines up 100% with how Arya left him) - and then when he died monk d00d buried him back on the isle.  Right?  SooOOooo he certainly COULD be on the isle trying to reform, his horsie Stranger is there in the stables.  The only question from me was, did I miss some subtle passage or description of a passerby that you caught or is this a guess?  I'm willing to believe either.  Smiley
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Lucy St. Jude
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« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2007, 03:25:29 PM »

did I miss some subtle passage or description of a passerby that you caught

Yep!  I don't have the book in front of me to find the exact passage, but it's there.  This is a pretty decent summary I found online:

Brienne (VI)   pg 460

"Upon reaching the Quiet Isle, Brienne and her companions are taken up the path to see the Elder Brother. Brienne mentions to the brother guiding them that she is heading for Saltpans to kill the Hound. This takes the man aback, but he tells them to speak to their elder. They see a huge horse in their stables, obviously a war horse, who had mauled two of the brothers. And on a hill, they pass a huge cloaked novice digging graves. The man appears lame, but they cannot see his face (if this isn't Sandor Clegane, I'll eat my hat!). The Elder Brother speaks further of the horrible raid on Saltpans, made worse by the fact that Ser Quincy Cox hid behind his castle walls and did nothing to help the villagers. After dinner, the Elder Brother speaks in private with Brienne. He asks what she seeks in Saltpans, and when she mentions a highborn girl, the elder knows she refers to Sansa.

            He lets on that it is the wrong Stark she seeks, for the Hound had captured Arya. Shocked that both of Lady Catelyn's daughters may yet be alive, she is equally surprised when he informs her that Sandor Clegane was dead. The Elder Brother had buried his corpse himself, and left the hound's-head helm on the grave. It was some other outlaw who found and wore it when they raided Saltpans. He goes on to tell her that he took pity on Sandor before he died, and would only say that "he is at rest" when she asks if he were truly dead. The elder remarks that the horse in their stables was the Hound's, Stranger. The Elder Brother then tells her that he was once a knight who fought for Prince Rhaegar at the Trident. He had taken several terrible wounds in the battle, fell in the river, yet awoke upon the shores of the Quiet Isle. "

My take on the Elder Brother's lie is that to him, "Sandor 'the Hound' Clegane" is dead and all of his crimes are behind him, so that he can start over newborn as an acolyte, the same way the Elder Brother did after the battle of the Trident.
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Rainee
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« Reply #6 on: February 08, 2007, 03:43:37 PM »

Yeah, that's how I interpreted it, too.
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Derrick Heyoka
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« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2007, 05:35:54 PM »

Yeah I remember it well (considering I read it like last week, heh).  Yeah OK sounds like it's prob'ly him, though I wouldn't say 100%.  I'm having trouble imagining Sandor giving himself over to The Seven, no matter how fucked up and looking for death.  I bet you're right (although Martin may never do anything with it), but I'm not one million percent convinced. 
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« Reply #8 on: February 08, 2007, 05:41:43 PM »

The folks at Westeros.org think he's alive: http://www.westeros.org/Citadel/FAQ/Entry/Is_Sandor_dead/
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Derrick Heyoka
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« Reply #9 on: February 08, 2007, 11:24:52 PM »

Yep, sounds right.  I'm still having trouble seeing it though, guess I'm just bitter that he wussed out.   Grin
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« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2007, 08:42:46 AM »

Yep, sounds right.  I'm still having trouble seeing it though, guess I'm just bitter that he wussed out.   Grin

The way he talked about Sandor at con makes me think he's not ready to let him go... and his 'death' was off-screen.  Even if an author is using character demises to increase tension, having people die without narrative usually doesn't do much to increase that.
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Lucy St. Jude
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« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2007, 01:36:53 PM »

Indeed!  That's why I don't think Davos is dead either.  As Theon showed us with "Rickon" and "Bran", those bones on the walls at White Harbor could belong to anyone.
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Derrick Heyoka
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« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2007, 01:43:10 PM »

Indeed!  That's why I don't think Davos is dead either.  As Theon showed us with "Rickon" and "Bran", those bones on the walls at White Harbor could belong to anyone.

The only reason I don't think this applies to Davos is because he may not have died off screen, his on screen may simply have been moved to the next book since it's all simultaneous like.  But you've definitely convinced me about Sandor.
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